106 Miles to Chicago

The DaVinvi Code is like Hitler. It tells little truth and big lies which attracts people. It is very cleverly written which leads me to believe that the author is controlled by Satan as Hitler was. Instead, read my book and gain spiritually as many others have. It is true and is called Finding The Light, I make no profit from it.

Sounds like a religious fanatic who can't open his eyes. This book is well-researched and based on historical fact.

(And, as evil as Hitler was, I doubt he was 'controlled' by the Devil. He was a product of the times, his society and the problems he and his country were facing. I'm not defending him by any means, I hope he rots in hell. I just don't think that he was controlled by 'the Devil'.)

Anyone who believes that this book is, "well-researched and based on historical fact," is quite frankly a fool who believes what ever he reads. There are so many deceptions, stretched truths, tweaked facts, and outright lies that the work as a whole is not to be taken seriously. Hey, did you know that there was NO vatican at the time of Constantine!? So how did the Vatican conspire with Constantine?! This may be an entertaining work, but the propaganda of it being based on fact is simply to gain sales. It's loosely based on myths that are loosely based on misinterpretations of truth. I can't believe so many people accept it as fact because the author says it is!

I think that The DaVinci Code is a great book. It is well researched (look at the bibliography for The DaVinci Code on Dan Brown's website) and makes complete sense. I honestly don't think the author was putting down Christianity. In fact, some priests and nuns have congratulated him on his successes. Look at the paintings by Leonardo DaVinci that are mentioned in the novel. A women is seated next to Jesus. There is also more than one chalice.
I believe that you can love your faith and think that The DaVinci Coed is folly (which i personally don't agree with), but that does not make this book like Hitler. That comparison is taking it a little far. Hitler killed millions of innocent people. No matter what anyone says, this book is not killing anyone. It is merely stating what could be the true life of Jesus.
Also, if people are fools for believing "whatever they read", couldn't the same be said about those who read the Bible? Who can say which is right - The DaVinci Code's theory or the Bible? How can you take what the Bible says to be true and not even try to think about that somethings said in The DaVinci Code could even be partly true?

I have spoken to several people of jewish faith who have read The Da Vinci Code and they are taking it to be true, that Jesus had sex with a prostitute and they seem to feel blessed by this book proving to them that the Mesiah was not Jesus and we Christians are all wrong, it hurts me to see this reaction created by a fiction book, once more another generation is crucifying Jesus! So to me The Da Vinci book is proof that the devil still walks the earth in 2003, now think about that before you pay your hard earned money for that book!

ok, a couple of things..

1) It is not the fault of the author that people base theological beliefs on a work of fiction. No matter how well-researched the book is, it is still fiction so it is ridiculous to base whether or not Jesus was the Messiah on it.

2) Who is crucifying Jesus? These folks of Jewish faith? That's just nonesense.

3) There are many more reasons to believe Satan walks the earth than the publishing of a novel.

It is true that any popular work that takes a stab at established religion will be viewed by believers as the work of Satan. Christianity was founded on the basis of good vs. evil, uneducated practitioners who come into contact with opposing views of the early church dogma will usually turn on the author as evil, that's to be expected. But it not their fault Christianity especially Catholicism was set up by men who embedded it with ritualistic nonsence and hokus-pokus to first enrich themselves at any cost and secondly to shield themselves from ever having to explain why all of the Apostles were married, Jesus had brothers and sisters and his message had nothing to do with donating all your money to their failed corporate plan. Recent exposure of church hierarchy by "The Boston Globe" should have explained what has been going on there to you. Read the "DaVinci Code" and while your at it try "Ceasar to Christ" by Will Durant written 40 years ago and maybe your eyes will be opened.The message is simple, its not the middle ages don't depend on these organizations especially when they are that rich, for the truth, find it your self and God Bless!

Jesus The Christ was first a man. He never claimed to be God, only saying "...my Father is in me, as I am in Him." This speaks of the universal bond between parent and child - it is natural and universal (holy). The Beattitudes were simple instructions on how to live a life of right-mindedness (a holy life). Kindness, mercy, justice, reverance, respect and acceptance are universal principles leading to a happy and prosperous (blessed) endeavor whether the endeavor be one's day or one's life. Our fears are reflections of what we percieve to be true. When we realize we cannot understand our perception, we become open to understanding the lie of the ego. How good it is to lay down one's burdens at the end of a day, or a life thinking:"I have done my best and have done no harm. I am loved - now I will rest." Fear not, for you also are my children. We are One.

Jesus The Christ was first a man. He never claimed to be God, only saying "...my Father is in me, as I am in Him." This speaks of the universal bond between parent and child - it is natural and universal (holy). The Beattitudes were simple instructions on how to live a life of right-mindedness (a holy life). Kindness, mercy, justice, reverance, respect and acceptance are universal principles leading to a happy and prosperous (blessed) endeavor whether the endeavor be one's day or one's life. Our fears are reflections of what we percieve to be true. When we realize we cannot understand our perception, we become open to understanding the lie of the ego. How good it is to lay down one's burdens at the end of a day, or a life thinking:"I have done my best and have done no harm. I am loved - now I will rest." Fear not, for you also are my children. We are One.

Good points, Chris, but I disagree that Jesus never claimed to be God. Consider his claim that he would sit "at the right hand of the Father" after his ascension into Heaven. It's clear that he was laying claim to a twin throne, or equality with God the Father. The Church uses the aforementioned expression to affirm Christ's equality with the Father and consequent divinity.

Jesus was a man. A kind, intelligent, inquisitive man with a lot to say and the confidence to say it. He did these things at a time when people were living in complete fear of the unknown.

Where do we come from? Why was my family murdered we were good people? etc.

Jesus spread messages of hope and positivity, encouraging all people to love ande live harmoniously. He was basiccaly you're everyday hippie. But, he created such an audience and a following for himself that the powers that were took notice. They began to usse the now embellished story of Jesus to suit themselves. To control the masses through fear and ritual. Over centuries and many revisions the writings about Jesus became just that. A tool to control modern man by exploiting his fears and insecurities and declaring that he must follow centuries old ritual and tradition to avoid that storied bastion of evil called HELL. All the while pumping money into the catholic church. The bottom line is: Jesus was wise, he had a big heart and a lot of good things to say about how people should treat people. Love him for that because that is the legacy that he left as a man. This legacy that the catholic church chose to embellish and morph into a mechanism of fear and control that enables it to perpatuate itself is a whold nother story. Treat people right, have a loving heart, listen more than you speak, judge not, and never look down on others. If you live like this you will be down with jesus. If you follow all of the rules of the catholic church you're serving them under a cloud of guilt. I seriously doubt jesus would approve.

Bottom line: Jesus was a guy with a lot of cool things to say. To be like him, just act like him. Be kind thoughtful, and caring. Care about your fellow man. YOu don't need to spend an hour on your knees reciting the same thing week in and week out to be cool with Jesus. That is the business of Jesus that the church created and works so hard to maintain. Just be Good and you're good with JC.

Several things:
Jesus is God...look up a "burning bush".
John, as nice as what you said sounds, the only way to avoid HELL is to believe. You can be the nicest person in the world, but if you don't believe, you're going to Hell. It's not that hard, just declare (out loud or in private...doesn't matter, He hears you just the same) that you believe Jesus is Lord and King of you and that he died for you. That's it. After that, it's easy to live the way He wants you to, and to do what He has planned for you. Blessings.

I think it's great that this book has caused so much reaction from people of different faiths and walks of life. I find it disturbing that people who claim to be christians will talk about the new testament as being the true words of Christ and not even be able to show proof. The Messiah spoke aramaic and the bible is written in greek and then translated into English. For example the messiah could have said in Aramaic "Inne Saba" which can mean I am the son of saba or I am the Son of God or even I am the son of man. All three of these are possibilities and leads it self to further study.I agree that this book probably has some or no nuggets of truth but it goes to show you that people of all faiths when faced with such shocking allegations should follow this advice.1: Do not judge-only God is judge and only God knows the real status of who's going to paradise in the hereafter. 2: Fast and pray in supplication and ask the most wise for wisdom of discernment. 3: Continue to study "Read in the name of you Lord." then you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free.

okay people!
the person sitting by Jesus my Lord was not a woman! And i dont understand y u people believe
this! There were not white jews with blue eyes back then!
also if Davinci and That author would have studied a lil more they would have know that there where no tables back then they sat on the floor! and there where no window either!
Also mary was not Jesus' mistress, lover, wife, or what ever u want to call it! Jesus was 100 percent man and 100 percent God!
The only man in the world that never commited a sin! Another thing is people from Nazareth where not allowed to marry. If u would read ur Bible or do research u would know!
People dont believe in this!
God Bless!
sorry for being choppy in a rush!

first off to respond to Keldz, if no one from nazereth was allowed to marry, then there would have been no people from nazereth unless they all had premarital sex, which i highly doubt and i also doubt that people would decide to pack up and just move to nazereth. it is a little bit different to travel back then than it is today. second we get the idea of jesus being divine from the idea that he was the son of god. but arent we all God's children? ive gone to catholic school my whole life and have been told that on a regular basis. in my opinion, if jesus was just a regular joe shmoe, it makes his legacy and life that much more amazing.

Um, Jesus as God? Jesus, never committed a sin? Well if you read your Bible, the new testament specifically, you will find that Jesus' mother Mary didn't even believe in him. In fact, she and his other siblings came to retrieve him saying he was out of his mind. When Jesus was told his family was calling for him, he instead of coming to his mother who summoned him said, "those who believe in my father are my mother and sisters and brothers." In addition to that, how can you say that Jesus was God, when he said that he himself was only a prophet. When he says a ""prophet" has no honor in his own home." Then again when he is accused of being a prophet, he states, "didn't the prophets say that we are all gods."

Anyone making comments about Jesus, please read the Bible and don't say what you think you know.

One

Does it say anywhere in the bible that jesus did or did not have a wife/lover? Could it have been completely possible? People believe in the bible, why not in the odyssey? The odyssey is a book about a man who lived long ago. How do we know the bible is not just ancient fairy tales?

People need to remember one thing. All religions are based on one main aspect... faith. If there was concrete, empericle evidence for any one religion, dont you think we would all know about it. Think about Hinduism.... it is the oldest religion still practiced today. And Hindus have no written "bible." Its faith, not evidence that feed a belief or religion.

I read the book and enjoyed it. The author took bits and pieces from alot of old conspiracy theories, myths, and half-truths. He also used real places and historical documents. If you go to his website (danbrown.com, I think), he has included a bibliography of works regarding Mary M, the Grail, Templars, historical Jesus research, etc.

If you spend some time researching these works you'll find that most have grains of truth but can't really prove much and contain theories that stretch logic pretty far. The website also includes pictures of the Rosslyn Church, Temple Church, Opus Dei New York headquarters, etc. There is a reproduction of daVinci's Last Supper with a pretty good looking red head sitting next to Jesus. (But, again, remember this isn't actually a photograph from history, it is a painting done 1500 years after the fact by someone whose full motives we don't know.)

I applaud the author for the amount of research he did and he's produced a good fictional thriller. He says on his website that Robert Ludlum is one of his favorite authors and his research and writing reflect it - similar to Ludlums' use of a real life character, Carlos the Jackal, in his Bourne series.

Just because an author uses myth and alternate theories about the development of Christianity in writing a piece of fiction doesn't mean he's being used by the devil. Nor should anybody assume that the author intended this to be serious history.

I read the book and enjoyed it. The author took bits and pieces from alot of old conspiracy theories, myths, and half-truths. He also used real places and historical documents. If you go to his website (danbrown.com, I think), he has included a bibliography of works regarding Mary M, the Grail, Templars, historical Jesus research, etc.

If you spend some time researching these works you'll find that most have grains of truth but can't really prove much and contain theories that stretch logic pretty far. The website also includes pictures of the Rosslyn Church, Temple Church, Opus Dei New York headquarters, etc. There is a reproduction of daVinci's Last Supper with a pretty good looking red head sitting next to Jesus. (But, again, remember this isn't actually a photograph from history, it is a painting done 1500 years after the fact by someone whose full motives we don't know.)

I applaud the author for the amount of research he did and he's produced a good fictional thriller. He says on his website that Robert Ludlum is one of his favorite authors and his research and writing reflect it - similar to Ludlums' use of a real life character, Carlos the Jackal, in his Bourne series.

Just because an author uses myth and alternate theories about the development of Christianity in writing a piece of fiction doesn't mean he's being used by the devil. Nor should anybody assume that the author intended this to be serious history.

I read the book and enjoyed it very much. Keep in mind it is an admitted work of FICTION!!!!!! The author says as much. Also, someone mentioned that the only way to avoid hell is to believe, but, what if you don't believe it hell? Do all buddhists, moslems, hindus, taoists etc. go to hell simply because they've inadvertantly chosen the "wrong" religion? Are hardcore christians upset that maybe, buried somewhere between stretches of Brown's imagination and history are actual nuggets of truth?

An interesting thing I read in a Paul McCartney interview, and before you damn the person just read what he had to say. "If you add an "O" to God, you get "Good", If you add a "D" to evil, you get "Devil"

Take that as you will folks, I just found it interesting.

Having read the book and read through all of the comments posted here to date, I'm amazed by one thing ... WISHFUL THINKING.

There are those who have read the book and seem to simply want to believe what it says mostly because it's a good story. Not because the author has substantiated anything. None of those who have argued for why the book might be true have put forth any reasonable argument (other than, "check his references" which one person has pointed out are pretty much unsubstantiated theories).

On the other hand, there are those who think the book is lies from the Devil because it disagrees with Christianity. And they put forth almost no arguments as to why it must be false (unless we accept their brand of faith as true regardless).

It's all WISHFUL THINKING. Here's what I wish: that we would all go to heaven (with the possible exceptions of Hitler, Stalin and Chirac), join hands, lay our differences aside and live in peace forever; that I would win the lottery; that I could have an extended 30 day orgasm. But of course the realities of life get in the way!

C'mon people, let's talk about some facts if we want to have a discussion that might yield results. Here are a few to start with:

(1) Homer's Odyssey is fiction. Why is that a fact? #1 because you're not dumb enough to believe it. #2 because there were no corroborating accounts of it published.

(2) Jesus did live. Why is that a fact? There are literally hundreds of accounts of his life.

(3) Power corrupts. Just about every person in power (with the exception of Jesus) abused their power. That includes the Catholic church, Jewish church, Moslem leaders, goverment leaders, military leaders, etc. Don't base your judgments about someone's faith, culture or values on what another corrupt individual does. Using that logic, I would say that we should destroy the Muslim world because that world has produced a pretty significant number of suicidal bastarts recently. People would rightly condemn me for that. Don't make the same mistake by saying that Catholics abused power or Protestant leaders have had affairs therefore all Christ followers are hypocrites.

(4) 12 guys voluntarily died because they said that Jesus came back from the dead and that they had witnessed it personally. That's in the Bible. That's also in other historical contemporary texts and Roman records. Everyone agrees that Jesus talked about excellent values that have transcended the generations. But if these 12 guys died because they wouldn't confess that he never came back from the dead then either: (1) Jesus was also an expert brainwasher - inconsistent with everything else he said and did, or (2) Jesus came back from the dead. Draw your own conclusions.

(5) The Bible, both Old Testament (pre-Jesus) and New Testament (the life of Jesus and the early Christ-following church), has not been revised over the generations. In fact, very early copies of the manuscripts still exist that have proven that it has been unchanged since very early on (if memory serves, we have copies of New Testament writings from about the year 70 - and the dead sea scrolls date to pre-Christ times). If the Bible was altered, it was done while people were still living who had known Jesus (and who would have almost certainly left some record of their differences from the published historical accounts). The Catholic church couldn't do much altering of the Old Testament, because the Jewish people also held it as sacred and were preseving it for years before Catholicism was ever founded (in fact, before Jesus was born).

(6) A lot of people in power want you to believe a modified version of the Bible. Why? Because it preserves their power. Don't trust anyone's word on what the truth is ... make INFORMED (not WISHFUL) decisions about where you can find the truth and explore it yourself.

Blessings.

Actually you are all right. That's the beauty of being you. Of course it might help to know that there are even some who believe Jesus was a rabbi and was even quite an expert at the wisdoms of Kaballah ritual. You have to understand that to Jews, the meaning of life was perpetuation, of Torah, g-ds law, to educate, to make children and to counsel others. Whether he was this or that beyond that is simply a need for others to have something to hang their faith hat on.

It's hard to think a group of men would create something that others would follow? No of course we can. It's done everyday. You would have to factor each decade, century and era not to mention every powerful person of each moment in history to begin to understand why religions are even created in the first place much less this one.

More have died in the name of religion than anything ever and man is great at killing. Woman on the other hand are a bit easier on the species. That's why I vote we turn over the world to women. No seriously, the book is fun and truthfully, if you can't take a joke, you shouldn't have bought the pizza. G-d wants us to do unto others as we would want them to do unto us. The rest is commentary.

Maimonides

i do believe a few things stated above are correct. the wishful thinking is true. no side can back up what is being said. the book was written not to change anyone's mind or to anger anyone, however it was written to challenge your beliefs. it is not saying any one belief is right or wrong, but it's saying "you don't really know where you belong until you question who, how, and what you are." like jesus, this book is trying not to perpetuate anger and hatred, but to bring understanding, broaden your knowledge base, and to provide an alternate way of thinking. this is no devious threat.

also carbon dating of the oldest version of the bible has shown that it was written hundreds of years after jesus' death. however, because it was written by men, women are objectivized and not treated as equals.

my real problem is: why are public schools only teaching one view of history? brown was right in stating that only the victor's point of view survives, but nothing is even mentioned about another point of view. why is this? i went to a private school for 9 years, and a public school that boasted it's high scoring students for four, and the private catholic school taught me more about history, diversity in history, and alternate views than the public school did. why is it that we have to wait until college for the sugar coating to be removed?

Hey if you get a chance, watch a movie called the g-ds must be crazy. It's a story of the misadventures of Junt-wasi tribesman from the African Kalahari Desert. They live deep in the Kalahari and have never seen a white person and have rarely had contact with anyone else. They live a peaceful life, sharing everything and hunting and gathering all of their necessities.

One day, a pilot carelessly drops a Coca-cola bottle out of his plane. It changes their lives drastically. Since there was only one bottle, and everyone wanted to use it, the family members grew jealous of each other for the first time ever.

OK, innocence is bliss right?

I'm really thinking more on the lines of why can't we all just get along. In this example, they all were happy and innocently going about their lives until something challenged their beliefs. In actuality they really were unable to accept such a variable for change.

This in itself has been a struggle most often fought on the battleground of fear. Just like your school upbringing where only one doctrine was taught basically because that's the way it was written and g-d help us all if Pleasantville shows a hint of color. (Another fun movie by the way)

Pick a point in time and I'll show you some leader conquering some land trying to implant his say-so on whom he conquers. Just like we do today all the way from how business is run to our wonderful world leaders.

However, to the credit of modern western thinkers, one of the most interesting things to ever come out of any political doctrine was the separation of Church and State. That simple fact created by our wonderful pink-fleshed farmers of long ago attempted to halt the evil that man perpetrated on man in the name of g-d.

From that point forward the church was forced to focus within its own borders and thus could only spew forth its word to those that would listen or rather pay to listen. And then there was cable.

No seriously, the most important thing anyone can do in his or her life beyond procreation is to help your fellow man. Give and give double what you think as it will come back twice fold to you so you can give double again.

Our world needs to stop beating man to the ground and start helping him up with both hands. But, unfortunately, hate breads hate and in many parts of the world, hate is all they ever know just as fear was all the church knew would keep man in line.

Innocence is bliss and wisdom is faith. Pass it on.

This is ridiculous. All of it. Thanks for making me want to shoot myself. I have to agree with Mr. JJ, why the hell can't we just get along? WHO CARES if I believe something different? Get your heads out of your asses and realize there is more to what makes up a person than religious beliefs.

Your comments are each educational in their own way (even the hateful ones). One additional comment I've yet to see here: Faith challenged means faith affirmed. If you have read Brown's book and not seen your faith challenged, then your faith is blind. If your faith was truly challenged, leading to further questions and then reaffirmation, then Brown has done yeoman service to you. I did not read DaVinci Code looking for truths, but my follow-up research (the Web is a wonderful new world) has reaffirmed my views of the world, and they are not the views presented by Dan Brown! Therefore, do not fear challenges to your faith. Seek them out. If your faith is strong, it will thereafter be stronger. If your faith is based on blind adherance without support, the result can be a life of ignorance instead of a search for the real truths, whatever they may be. For example, if a mind was brainwashed by Communism to believe that Capitalism was solely a cynical ploy to keep the wealth with the richest few, would it be unfaithful to learn of a different path to social justice? Do not fear differing perspectives. Instead, learn from the views of others and develop or reaffirm your own faith. God bless.

We are all children of God and Jesus was no exception. God is within all of us, but even more so Jesus, because he had a mission on Earth. Jesus is the Universal savior of us all and religions are irrelevant. Before Jesus, religion and ritual were of the upmost importance particularly in the Jewish faith. The average man had no connection to god and the jewish leaders were like gods on earth. jesus was our savior because he came with a new message which basically said if you accept him as the word and son of god he will not reject you at the gates of heaven. Jesus never claimed to be anything without god, and he certainly didnt devote his life long message for money. Y would he risk his life for something that would lead no where. Sure he had followers but what did he get out of them, attention? They aren't doing him any good now that he is dead unless it is all true. Jews have long been considered gods chosen people but jesus came to save the whole world. He doesn't require you to belong to any religion and says the best place to find god is within your self. The world is cursed and evil and its not crazy to think evil has a foothold on religion. There is only one true god but religion has us all blind that (jews,christians,muslums). Jesus was the first to suggest the universal power of his father and his compassion for the world that he sent his son to redeem all the evil on earth. Our souls didn't just magically appear the instanct we were born, they were somewhere before(with god) and jesus wants us all to return. I cant say excactly where religions stand today, but my best advice to u is, do not trust the world. It is evil and corupt. The devil was cast down to earth to lead it astray so i say turn to yourself. Look inside your heart and mind to find god. When children come into the world they are pure and innocent becuase they haven't been corupted by the world yet. God Bless

We are all children of God and Jesus was no exception. God is within all of us, but even more so Jesus, because he had a mission on Earth. Jesus is the Universal savior of us all and religions are irrelevant. Before Jesus, religion and ritual were of the upmost importance particularly in the Jewish faith. The average man had no connection to god and the jewish leaders were like gods on earth. jesus was our savior because he came with a new message which basically said if you accept him as the word and son of god he will not reject you at the gates of heaven. Jesus never claimed to be anything without god, and he certainly didnt devote his life long message for money. Y would he risk his life for something that would lead no where. Sure he had followers but what did he get out of them, attention? They aren't doing him any good now that he is dead unless it is all true. Jews have long been considered gods chosen people but jesus came to save the whole world. He doesn't require you to belong to any religion and says the best place to find god is within your self. The world is cursed and evil and its not crazy to think evil has a foothold on religion. There is only one true god but religion has us all blind that (jews,christians,muslums). Jesus was the first to suggest the universal power of his father and his compassion for the world that he sent his son to redeem all the evil on earth. Our souls didn't just magically appear the instanct we were born, they were somewhere before(with god) and jesus wants us all to return. I cant say excactly where religions stand today, but my best advice to u is, do not trust the world. It is evil and corupt. The devil was cast down to earth to lead it astray so i say turn to yourself. Look inside your heart and mind to find god. When children come into the world they are pure and innocent becuase they haven't been corupted by the world yet. God Bless

Oy – that’s about all I can add to Kevin’s output. Let me take a wild stab, Kevin is in his early 20’s, Caucasian, from a middle income family and is destined to be in a job with his name on his pocket. Richard is an MOT like myself and I would venture to guess he’s about 40ish, married, couple of kids and bored, which would explain why the heck he’s posting in the first place. Travis, would be a bit harder to decipher as his info is a bit light, but he’s white, about 30ish, single and has huge anger issues. Nonsense is also unique in that he’s from the IT sector, about 30ish, white, single and trying to make up his mind about life. Now, Mr. Hinkle (steve) I like. Here’s a guy who at least knows how to play down the middle. Don’t commit to either without investigating several would be his motto.
Mr. Taylor (Jeff) is a fairly intelligent sort and takes a cautious middle of the road approach as well. Justin on the other hand is a graduate student at Indiana U in Fort Wayne and he apparently was just having fun one evening. Ross (me) is also a white guy searching for somewhere to connect. Mr. Indigo (Fury) has some definite issues relating to Jesus. This is a guy who will take you on in a bar for looking at him too long. Mr. Keldz also has serious Jesus issues and refers to paintings as proof positive that someone had blue eyes? Dude, it’s a fucking painting? But then I could be mistaken because I remember you doing your thesis on Genetical Ophthalmological Deviations Correlating among Hebrews of the 1st century. You get two Oy’s. John had me going for a while as an intelligent sort until he went off on the 1,2,3 of how to get to heaven. Here’s a flash, you go, end of story. I would bet you voted for Bush. Chivon is gone. Dude, drop some LSD. That’s my advice. And on and on and on – OK – so by now you all are working hard to come up with a working scenario on me. I’ve judged you all and you all are now ready to defend yourselves.

Here’s the point. You’re men. Get over it. You are also all two-dimensional men.

If you can read the above about yourself and say, hmmm…ok..you’re funny..(not exactly true about myself, but you’re funny) then you have a chance to stop, take a breath, quiet your mind for a moment and listen. Listen to the silence telling you that time, as you know it is two-dimensional. You do not understand anything beyond yourselves and thus you must have a definition for this unknown. Guys like Elron Hubbard love you, as you are susceptible to his quibble. My advice to you all is to have fun in life. Love for all it is worth. Give of yourselves till you cannot give any more and then give again. Hold a small child in your hands and understand true innocence. Hold a dieing 90 year old in your hands and understand true acceptance.

The truth is, you are all wonderful people who have a chance to be something incredible. The first question g-d will ask you in heaven is this, “how did you treat others in business.” G-d wants you to know that how you conducted yourself within the community as this is what will define you.

Now, send me $100 each and I’ll play with your minds some more.

JJ over and out -

I find it very intriguing to see so many comments about Jesus and the bible that are obviously made with little true knowledge of the bible or Jesus.

One commenter said Jesus was like a Hippie with cool things to say. How many thousands of people would suffer great persecution and death over a hippie? All of the Apostles except for John died a horrible death proclaiming Jesus as God. Most died many years after Jesus’ resurrection. The gospels and letters were written while the witnesses to all that Jesus said and did were still alive. Remember that the Jews lived in a culture that would not allow for them to lie and get away with it. The bible would never of lived to this day if it could have been refuted within the fist 100 years after Jesus’ resurrection.

The bible says that Jesus lived a sinless life. People were on a mission to catch Jesus up in every moment, attempting to get him to say or do something that would be a sin. Three years they tried and not one, not one could cause him to sin. Could you go a day without sinning? Before you answer, make sure you know what the bible says about sinning and what constitutes a sin. I am a devout Christian, and I can’t go an entire day without committing some kind of sin. The little whit lies that people tell, the judgmental comments about others, the discouraging comments we make to or about others, getting mad and the words we say about the person that cuts us off in traffic, the TV shows we watch, the pretty girl that just walked by, what went through your mind about her? I could go on and on, could you go one day without sinning? The bibles tells us that Jesus never sinned, not once, ever. Who but God could do that.

Jesus’ claim to be God is irrefutable in the Gospel of John. Based on that, we should have nothing to do with anything or anyone, who attempts to use him as an opportunity to take potential believers down a wrong path.

JJ, you were right and wrong about me. I am white, yes. I am not in my 30's however, I'm in my 20's. As far anger issues go, you'll have to make up your own mind. I am though, tired of seeing peoples differing beliefs tear them apart. If that makes me two dimensional, than so be it. I would rather be two dimensional, and open minded to other people, thoughts, cultures, skin colors, religisou beliefs, etc... than be a 3 dimensional religious extremist. I can't decide what you are, however I've only read two of your posts. In my simple, two dimensional opinion, I think it's these hard-nosed, I'm right, you're wrong attitudes exhibited by many here, that is going to lead to our own very downfall.

We're all human, it's time to prove it - Justin Sane

JJ, you were right and wrong about me. I am white, yes. I am not in my 30's however, I'm in my 20's. As far anger issues go, you'll have to make up your own mind. I am though, tired of seeing peoples differing beliefs tear them apart. If that makes me two dimensional, than so be it. I would rather be two dimensional, and open minded to other people, thoughts, cultures, skin colors, religisou beliefs, etc... than be a 3 dimensional religious extremist. I can't decide what you are, however I've only read two of your posts. In my simple, two dimensional opinion, I think it's these hard-nosed, I'm right, you're wrong attitudes exhibited by many here, that is going to lead to our own very downfall.

We're all human, it's time to prove it - Justin Sane

damn double posts =/

You see people, Travis is thinking. That's all I ask. Consideration for all and for all to be considerate back. My intention was not to hurt anyone or poke seriously at anyone but to make you think and to perhaps let you in on a little secret, it's OK to be wrong and it's OK to love even though throughout your entire life or recent past the contrary held true. Basically put, if someone is trying to hammer a nail and they keep hitting your hand then you're probably a bit close.

JJ - you're making me LOL :)

I'm Hindu - to me, Christ was an important historical figure, not my personal savior.

My wife is Catholic, I go to church with her twice a month. I don't pay attention to any of the rituals (communion, etc.) or hymns. I sit there and pray that everyone in the world gets what they want out of life - whether it's money, peace, sex with twins, nice cars, whatever.

I go to the Hindu temple once a month. Again, I don't pay any attention to the hundred different idols there and people performing rituals to the idols. I just pray that everyone gets what they want out of life - money, peace, etc.

Then I go home and watch some football, play with the kids, and try convince my wife that it's time to buy more lingerie.

To me, religion is important if you need it to help you lead a good life. If it threatens to take over and make you do dumb stuff, lay off it. That goes for the muslim suicide bombers killing americans & Israelis, Israelis killing palestinians, Indians killing Pakistanis, Pakistanis killing Indians, Protestants killing Catholics, etc.

Tyrone,

What you say makes sense if all religion is, is a way to live your life. Like a guide book on how to get the best out of life. Religion in general is that way for many people. The difference between Christianity and the others is truth. Many other faiths in the world are grey in matter and not black and white. Christianity however, is a matter of fact for us. We believe that it is wholly and completely true. For many Christians, like me for example, had to come to the realization that Jesus is exactly who he says he is. I fought it for most of my life, living in denial, until I decided to do my homework and check it all out completely without bias. Once I realized that with all the data, there was no denying that Jesus is exactly who he says he is. The Son of God. Then, and only then, did I try to find out what I needed to do in my life, to do what he wanted me to do. It was not a comfortable transition. For some time, I did not like what the Bible said I should do in many situations, but knowing the truth about Jesus, I didn’t have a choice. It is simply much easier living a life not following Christ. I follow because I believe, not because I need some guide on how to live a good life. It so happens that Jesus does that as well, as you would expect God to do. Before a Christian can decide if they are going to change and model Jesus’ example in the bible, they simply have to decide if they believe in Jesus. Once you do that, you can’t help but want to do what he says and after a while, as you grow in your understanding, what was once difficult to do, now becomes very easy because of faith.

I would encourage you to read a book by Lee Stroble titled “A Case for Christ”. It is compelling. See how you view Jesus and Christianity after that book.

God Bless,

Barry

I feel bad for all you followers of God, Christ, Allah, whatever it is. All you suckers are getting taken in to the greatest prank in the history of mankind. Life = Science, not faith. How could a majority of the world be so stupid? OPEN YOUR EYES AND LOOK AT THE FACTS!

OK, once again we got a zealot in our midst. It’s getting rather silly to continue to explain to you young minds that although you have found a spiritual path that is leading you towards a greater good in you, I’m afraid to bust your bubble for fear you might get lost, but on the hopes that you might be able to grasp a new concept without thinking I am trying to reprogram you, take a moment and read further –

Question 1 – How did this all begin?
Question 2 – Why now?
Question 3 – Who are you?

If you look at question 1 from any direction, spiritual, physical, metaphysical, scientific, universal, etc…. you will come to one conclusion… it did. Meaning, you and I will not
Know how or why for that matter. To put a label on this simple truth is merely to do just that for the sake of attempting to explain the number one unknown of our existence on this rock in this spiritual plane.

Now, let’s suppose you can actually grasp that concept. Can you then perhaps begin to grasp the concept of time? We measure time simply because we consciously thinking westernized carbon units (pardon me Gene) again, need labels.

This leads us to question 2, which asks, why now. This too is an arrogant question as is how did this all begin because we need to know simply because then we have some ground zero to which we can stack our moments on top and call it something else, a life.

Which brings us to questions 3 – who are you. And once again, this means that you must have a label to which you can point to so that you know who you are.

Loosing this need to know is the key to unlocking your mind and allowing you to grow well beyond your current cranial limits. You believe in Jesus, you believe the world was formed one way or another, you believe you are here for a purpose; you believe therefore you can exist. For the majority of the world, this is the case as this is all the majority can handle least they go insane.

It’s like trying to live in a room void of sound. Lack of stimuli will soon lead to wonder, to fear, to fright and continue to escalate from there….

So man needs stimuli, he needs to know, he needs other people and he needs a system to which he can belong and thus feel safe and in control.

Before you found Jesus you may have struggled for many reasons. You’re ADHD, your parents beat you, your father did not hug, your mom was over protective, your have a tiny penis, you smoked too much pot in college, The Ozbornes…. whatever…the point is all these things created this person you were at the time living within the circumstances of the time and one day, when you found Jesus, you suddenly felt this inner peace. Your life fell into order, you found a wife, you performed better at your job, you found yourself sleeping 8 hours.

What you did was find inner peace. You let go. You quit holding on to all the things you thought made you and you let go. You suddenly believed in yourself. BUT, because you are a sheep and not a tiger, you must have some label to pin on this inner peace because you are incapable of believing that you did it on your own. You let go.

Religion has its purpose, and to many it is the giant joke of the age of man.

The bottom line is this, if you believe that things happen as a result of simple coincidence than you are probably secular in your beliefs –

If you think things happen as a result of some divine reason, then you are most probably of a religious nature –

Blending the 2 while letting go is the next step to understanding – read this a couple of times and I will be back later…..

I believe this book is possibly the biggest load of lies ever compiled. I agree with the idea that this author is controlled by the devil. Read revelations. It speaks of the time of the antichrist. This book clearly demonstrates the principles of the antichrist. Now I am not saying the author is the antichrist but I am saying that if you believe what this writer says you might as well jump in a firey pit....cause thats where you will be headed. Please don't believe the lies! Turn around now! All who seek Him will be saved.

I have rarely stepped into this discussion because I've been intrigued by the back-and-forth between all who have commented on.

I do need to say something about the previous comment and it's something that bothers me very often in discussions about the 'end times.' It is the book of Revelation. It is not plural but singular.

Also, let's not forget that this book is a novel. It is ficiton. It is not a theological treatise on the history of the church.

Fascinating. I came to this site looking for a spirited discussion of the book, which I found. I was also hit with a revelation: The only thing worse than an inane, knuckleheaded post that says nothing (like this one) is a post hinting at enlightenment laced with revelation.

JJ: You spend so much time wrapped up in your own self-important inner revelations it's a wonder you can remember to take successive breaths. You're the definition of someone who likes to hear themseleves talk but hasn't heard a word someone else has said in years. Fortunately, your perception of self-importance acts as the defense mechanism which precludes you from glimpsing your true reality-- the self-granted soap box from which you blabber faces a mirror and your words and thoughts have only you as an audience.

Put down the twinkies, get off the couch, and join the rest of us in the real world. Go pay some nice working girl for a blowjob-- it will change your life.

Oh, to save you the trouble: I'm the college educated, married, white guy that used to choose you last in elementary school gym class, was dating those girls in high school that you could only jerk off to, but is now kind enough to allow you to clean his pool.

Well, this has been fun.

*random thought*

For those who feel religion is a joke, ask yourself why? Why is it a joke? Is it because you want to bang a lot of girls without a guilty conscience? Is it too much work to spend a few hours a week demonstrating your faith? Do you not believe the principles, such as Jesus being the son of God? OR, is it because religion has become incredibly twisted? MAYBE it's because 9/10 wars are fought in the name of God, often times the same God. IS IT POSSIBLE that you're disgusted by how religion has gone beyond being spiritual, gone beyond being a belief or faith, and has started being a corporation? I don't know about you, but those are my reasons for being disgusted with the current religious climate of the world. Maybe I haven't tried everything. Maybe I haven't tried Eastern religions. Maybe I haven't tried your religion, which I'm sure, is better than the rest. However, from the religions I have dabbled in, I've been so turned off by the people, the actions, the attitudes, the molesting of children, the extortion of money, seeing people of the same faith killing each other in the name of the same God, that I have a hard time being enthusiastic about it. But, I'm not gonna get down on you if religion is your thing. I'm not gonna tell you that you're a lost soul, and are going to hell, because you DON'T believe in God either. No. I'm going to continue to believe what I believe, and be open to you and your ideas, and only expect the same in return. Maybe you'll go to heaven and I won't. Oh well. I guess I, and everybody else, will have to answer for themselves when they cross that bridge, and you or I shouldn't be worried or upset about what other people are doing and/or believing. Now, if you'll excuse me, of I'm off to party with the devil.

/end of rant

I keep looking for intelligent discussion of this book, and all I find all over the web are the frightened rantings of a bunch of threatened fanatics.

Does anyone know of where I can find decent discussion on the HISTORY represented in this novel beyond it's obvious and already overworked "religeous" implications?

By the way, the historical information presented in this book has been openly available and discussed for so many years by so many people that it's a shock that people are so disrupted and threatened by those same facts now. Kind of amusing, however.

After reading The DaVinci Code I headed on-line to do some research... I found that people either responded with violent anger or enthusiasm, generally divided down religious lines. Now I classify myself as a Christian, I was raised a Christian, I have been baptised and confirmed in the Lutheran Church and while yes, this did present questions, I do not understand why questioning is a threat. Why would I choose to believe something that cannot stand up to questioning? People seem to be extremely upset by the idea that Jesus was married, or had children. However, I don't understand why it is such a detrimental, radical, or "un-christian" concept. I always believed that the main principle of Christianity was love. "God so loved the world that he gave his one and only son..." Jesus was born of Mary and made man. God was made MAN. Man, as in human. Human beings experience more than one type of love. They have love of family, love of friends, but few would argue that some of life's most enriching relationships are based in romantic love, and no parent would dispute that love for one's children is overwhelming. Jesus was without sin, this does not mean he was chaste. Personally I have no problem with a God who was made incarnate on earth by a living, breathing man, a man who loved just as the rest of us do.

After reading The DaVinci Code I headed on-line to do some research... I found that people either responded with violent anger or enthusiasm, generally divided down religious lines. Now I classify myself as a Christian, I was raised a Christian, I have been baptised and confirmed in the Lutheran Church and while yes, this did present questions, I do not understand why questioning is a threat. Why would I choose to believe something that cannot stand up to questioning? People seem to be extremely upset by the idea that Jesus was married, or had children. However, I don't understand why it is such a detrimental, radical, or "un-christian" concept. I always believed that the main principle of Christianity was love. "God so loved the world that he gave his one and only son..." Jesus was born of Mary and made man. God was made MAN. Man, as in human. Human beings experience more than one type of love. They have love of family, love of friends, but few would argue that some of life's most enriching relationships are based in romantic love, and no parent would dispute that love for one's children is overwhelming. Jesus was without sin, this does not mean he was chaste. Personally I have no problem with a God who was made incarnate on earth by a living, breathing man, a man who loved just as the rest of us do.

I too would have liked to discuss this very interesting book but I find that I have stumbled upon a group of people that can't "discuss" anything. Your purpose in life is to trash anyone else that does not think/believe/act like you and that is the saddest part. I "believe" in my own way, not yours.
Your actions are so opposite from what you "preach".......and I "believe" Jesus would be ashamed of most of you because you are not getting his point.

Be nice to one another. Life is way too short.

To: Keldz
Re: comments on DaVinci's art

IT'S ART!! DaVinci was an artist--with his own INTERPRETATION of things. Bottom line. No matter what you believe. That is the beauty of all art--including literature--interpretation creates its value.

Wow, i think thats all i have to say about this discussion.

I found The Da Vinci Code to be an excellent novel. Well written, very well in fact. I loved it. I just can not believe that some of you would read so much into, to the point of calling Dan Brown 'Satanic'. That is very far fetched.

Those of you who call Dan Brown Satanic, ask yourself this; Why? Because he believes in something that you don't? or written something that totally goes against your particular religion? And that makes him satanic??

if my memory serves correct, which i'll admit right now, it may not. Jesus was presecuted, and crucified, for believing in something that others fear and rejected? am i correct? if not, KINDLY let me know. i have not stepped into a church in nearly 6 years now, with the exception of my best friend's mothers funeral, and then my best friend's wedding. Anyways, the point is and from the sounds of it, those who call Mr. Brown satanic obviously fear what he has written. For what ever the reasons, only their god would know. And more than likely, they fear the fact that their religion had been greatly (if unintentionally) attacked by a book. Is Mr. Brown trying to start something? Maybe a Pro-Paganistic view of the world? Only he would know.

Stop over annylizing a book, and if you truely hate it that much, burn the thing. It certainly hasn't stopped religions in the past from book burnings, why stop now?

Now, if you'll excuse me, I going to go party with Travis and the Devil . . . well hey, for a good decent party, i'll believe in anything, and then after the party, back to being a wiccan.

Toodles

~~Reichel~~

Hey, quick interesting thing, I find those of you who are attacking this (emphasis) work of fiction because it debunks your religion quite commical because you defend your arguments with what is commonly believed to be a (emphasis) work of fiction. If you're to do that, you can't yell at other people for believing a work of fiction (which has elements of truth, as I'm sure the Bible/any other Holy Scripture does), unless you want to be hypocritical.

And I've always gotton the impression that hypocrisy was a (audible gasp) sin. So, now, go repent, those of you who can't accept the fact that people might have other opinions and (gasp) actual reasoning and logic to back up their arguments, instead of just plain bashing other people (I.E. Dan Brown who wrote a book (gasp)) by comparing them to Hitler (who killed 12 million people).

Actually, I'm sorry, the comparison wasn't between Dan Brown and Hitler, it was between a book and Hitler. Apologies, I must now go be afraid that this book will start commiting atrocities like genocide. Because, you know, books are such hateful, concious being that they regularly participate in ethnic cleansing.

Hey Sky Diver - I graduated from Yale in 79, I have homes in LA, NY and St Thomas - Three kids, a wonderful wife, I am a record producer for a major label. Currently I am having fun building homes in Charlotte, Atlanta and Winter Park Fl for resale. I have over 1500 sq ft of commercial property and sit on 6 boards, work very closely with United Way, United Jewish Appeal and several other non-profit organizations. I just got back from Kokshetau Kazakhstan last week after adopting an 18 month old girl and am currently reading The Complete Sherlock Holmes Volume II. Anger issues are obviously something you might need to tend to as you seem inclined to take very dark stabs at my life and if you had been reading more closely towhat I was writing I think you might have had a bit less trauma had you dialed up the humor of which it was obviously intended.

Oh well - some people take themselves too seriously.

JJ over and out

Since the last post was dated Jan. 26th, I don't know whether this string is still going or not. Anyone still interested in an intelligent and reasonable discussion about this book?

Becki, feel free to try and generate more discussion. I'm not going to close the thread as long as things don't get out of hand.

Organized religions and the Catholic Church are a waste of time. The dark ages were dark because the church did not allow people to learn. To think about all of the great minds that were wasted by religious dogma is a frightening. For what? Some mythical stories and the promise of a better after-life. Ignorance is what the churches prey on. All you have to do is be is a follower, act like sheep and be guided by some pius, self-riteous interpreter of a storybook, or suffer for an eternity in hellfire. Today's religion is tomorrow's mythology.

Interesting comments on organized religion and the Catholic Church, but what about the information presented in The DaVinci Code as "facts." Are they or aren't they? Did Jesus marry Mary M? Was Constantine a Christian or not?
Did people think Jesus was divine before the Council of Nicea? Why does the Bible contain certain accounts of his life and not others, i.e. the Gnostic Gospels?

Well as for the Synod of Nicea, it was not truly to decide the divinity of Jesus, but to mend a tear in the church that had arisen. The divinity of Jesus is truly due to Paul's letters (to the Corinthians, etc...) which introduced the idea of being saved through total faith in Jesus as the one true son of God...an extension of the divine on Earth.

During the reign of Constantine, the church was well established, but still growing. When you read histories of Constantine, you do not get the feel of him being a Christian. He did support the church, however, because they backed him in return.

Anyway, Eustathius of Antioch, Alexander of Alexandria along with bishops of the church led by Ossius of Cordova convened the Council of Nicea and Constantine presided over the gathering (most likely to be the final word in case of disagreements...which he did do). The reason was a man named Arius. His position in the church is not clear, though he was below a bishop, clearly part of the clergy.

Arius had done an interpretation of the scripture that was growing in popularity. Instead of the Paulist view of a divine, direct-son-of-god Jesus, Arius preached that Jesus was a man and he was a Son of God, but as we all were. Leaving the door open to the views of Jesus being able to "sin", and not being infallible. This view of scripture gained popularity and Arius had many followers. You can imagine how this might have unnerved the establishment.

Therefore, they gathered the Synod of Nicea. The Council did indeed argue long and hard about the two different interpretations. They even grilled Arius about it, throwing scripture at him, and he answered well with his own views and explanations backing them up. The council was undecided, and it was Constantine who made the final decree. He came up with the idea of "homoousion", or that Jesus was both a divine being born of human flesh and blood. Jesus became "consubstantial", he was both directly a part of God, and existing in the flesh on Earth.

This was not a total fix, but the church in effect stripped Arius of his churchly power and installed this new doctrine as THE view of Jesus.

Interesting as a side note, this Council also decreed that the provinces in Northern Africa (i.e. Egypt, Libya) could continue practicing a mixture of church doctrine and native practices. The threat of revolt was scary to Constantine, so he leaned on the Council to make this decision.

- Matt

I've found all of these posts *interesting* but, I, too, would like to discuss the book.

I was disappointed at the end of the book. It was going so well that I couldn't put it down and then about page 400, it lost me. Maybe it was because I was reading it at 2:30 am and I'm usually asleep by 11:00 pm. But I didn't like the way the story progressed at that point.

Anyone have anything to discuss about the ending? About who The Teacher was? It seemed kind of thrown-together at that point.

That's all I want to discuss. I figure I believe what I believe (and agree with what I want to agree with). I don't want to change your mind and I don't want you to try and change mine.

I've heard that this book causes some people to think. Now, if it causes Christians to think, then the book is truly a miracle.

You say the theories in this book are unbelievable? What about the theories from your book?

Okay, let's see, on one hand, Dan Brown alledges that the Catholic Church suppressed women to gain power.

Okay, we know the Catholic Church will lie to cover their arses (or something to do with arses). And we know that throughout history, almost every society has become male dominated.

On the other hand, we have the "dead guy pushes a rock theory". Okay, nobody has ever come back to life after being dead for three days. Ever. Nobody.

What makes more sense? Think -- if you are not living in a jungle and not craving bananas, you can do it -- about it.